My starting point is that I value respectful discussion, rather than going to anger and name-calling if there is disagreement.
And with that, it is time for me to get back to an extremely hot topic, hot each time I wrote about it - where I ended up being called names by people on both sides - the pro-Israel side and the pro-Gaza side. In fact, that’s what most hit me - the extent to which some people quickly went to anger and denigration. I vividly remember being called a zionist shill (more than once). And then there was someone who, after making a number of angry derogatory statements, ended with, Unsubscribe me! - though there is an unsubscribe link at the bottom of every post that is sent out. Of course I unsubscribed that person.
Usually I don’t let denigrating and disrespectful statements remain on Substack. This time, I let them all remain - evidence of people’s responses.
Note: many people were not like this. Instead, for instance, if they disagreed, they might send a link and ask me to look at it. So they saw me as someone they could try to reach.
As usual, many people also expressed agreement, or had questions, or were uncertain. But those people are not what got me to write.
Here’s one thought I had. I do not believe that people CHOSE, after careful consideration, to respond with anger and name-calling. My sense is that these were automatic (programmed) responses to various things I said - different things triggering different people. My sense is also that people felt fully justified in making the responses they made.
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I learned a lot from the respectful comments I received. I will come to those in a further post.
I very much remember one person writing that she had woken up wondering if people ever changed their minds about Israel and Gaza.
I answered that I did not have the sense, when I got more information, of changing my mind. I remember my ex often being frustrated, claiming that I kept changing my mind. My answer, then and now, is that I do not have the sense of changing my mind, but of getting more information and taking it in. My sense is that my commitment is to the truth, human rights and freedoms, justice and our safety so we can flourish fully.
Here’s an instance where I seemingly changed my mind. I originally accepted that Islam is a religion of peace - that’s what I heard over and over. In a very early post - 2006, I believe - I wrote that Mohammed would be upset by how his religion of peace had been hijacked. One person - still a friend - answered that Mohammed would not be upset, and cited about a dozen quotes from the Quran about killing Jews wherever you find them, and so on. At my request for more quotes, he sent me perhaps another 40. I also did some research, got even more information. I had clearly been misinformed! I no longer held - I no longer hold - that Islam is a religion of peace.
But I did not, from my perspective, change my mind. I got more information.
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This time, in response to my first sendout about Israel and Gaza, I got more information. And then in response to my second sendout, I got even more information. I will deal with the new information in my next post on Israel and Gaza.
Here I will just mention one thing that has not changed. I was and continue to be for the existence of the state of Israel.
Why?
I’m for the continuing existence of Israel just as I’m for the continuing existence of Canada, the United States, Chile, Argentina, Barbados, Japan, Australia, etc.
These countries exist. Yes, many wrongs were done to many aboriginals in many of these countries by many of the newcomers. I especially remember the words of a famous American chief: “They broke every promise but one. They promised to take our land and they did.”
Quite a horror.
At the same time, when I was a young child, there was legal immigration and my parents came to Canada. I am very rooted in Canada.
It’s far from only me and my family. For centuries there has been the influx of people from many other areas of the world into Canada, the US, etc. We’ve settled, often for generations.
In Canada and some other countries, there have also been numerous financial and other settlements with aboriginals. They pay no tax, for instance!!!
It makes no sense to me to aim to undo the existence of Israel or of Canada or of Australia - or of Japan, and give Japan back to the 10,000 or so Ainu who still exist (the Ainu - the inhabitants of Japan before the arrival of the ethnic group that now inhabits most of Japan).
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Someone sent me a link to a video of a Hasidic person who does not believe Israel should exist because, according to his beliefs based on the religious texts he accepts, humans are not to create a state of Israel, only the god he believe in is to do that.
My response. Fine. That’s his belief.
As someone who does not identify with any religion, I hear his arguments but they don’t matter to me, in terms of whether Israel (or any other country) should or shouldn’t exist..
What resonates with me is that Israel exists and thrives. It has a high standard of education, for instance. Muslims in Israel are better educated, on average, than in any of the surrounding Muslim countries.
(Note: Israel also also a very high mRNA injection rate, along with the negative consequences from that.)
Anyway, for me, my starting point is that countries exist. I am not for undoing their existence.
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I am for people living well without doing violence to others. I am for putting energy into learning how to flourish ever more. I see that so much energy is often locked into hating and blaming and wanting to destroy. I am for using as much energy as possible for living full flourishing lives.
I am also for recognizing and acknowledging all that has happened. No pretending that unsavory - even horrible or horrific - parts of the past did not happen, or conversely believing that this is all that happened. To deny is very tempting, when it is a group we identify with. But we may also have been trained to stay immersed in shame.
I am not for staying locked, whether in recognition, denial, blame or shame.
That’s the core to my approach to personal development - Full Flourishing.
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I want to come to what I have learned about Israel and Gaza, and the ongoing need both for further learning and for recognizing there are many questions for which I cannot, at present, get answers.
What I have learned will be the focus of my next post on Israel and Gaza.
I got a wealth of information I am happy to pass on.
I will see the responses I get to this post.
Posted July 4, 2024
I’m very glad we can have this discussion
on Gaza/Palestine. Like you Elsa, I’m learning a lot and clarifying some of my previously held beliefs because of new information that I didn’t have before. I’ve traditionally always endorsed Israel seeing them as our ally in the Middle East.
The past 5 years or so I’ve really been questioning a lot of the narratives the US has put forth, in particular 911. I have no doubt that our ally in the Middle East has done similar things. It’s interesting that many here were calling it Israel’s 911. I’m inclined to say what links both “911s” is the ability of both governments to do terrible things to its own citizens. I find it difficult to believe that Israel accidentally left their border exposed. I’m inclined to believe they may have planned the entire attack for the purpose of finally being able to achieve their long desired goal of obliterating the Palestinians. Israel throughout history has always played the innocent victim. They have led the world to believe they embarked upon a noble goal of making a Jewish homeland from a barren, unoccupied land when in reality that could not be further from the truth. In the late 19th century and the first half of the 20th century , the area was a thriving home for the Palestinians. They had their own villages, gardens, homes, jobs and way of life. They lived peaceably with their Jewish and Christian neighbors who were the minority. Zionism never intended anything good for the Palestinian people. Once the globalist Rothschild family had coerced Britain into signing the Balfour Declaration of 1917 declaring Palestine a home for not just Jews but the Jewish race, the fate of the Palestinians was sealed. The Zionist movement now had the backing of one of the world’s superpowers who could put down any Palestinian protests and uprisings. The Rothschilds had been encouraging settlement of Palestine even well before the Balfour Declaration. The Rothschilds had been buying up some of the land during the Ottoman Empire. The Ottoman Empire fighting on the side of Germany was broken up after Germany was defeated in World War I. Britain now had the mandate on Palestine. Israel has whitewashed the destruction of 400-500 Palestinian villages, the massacre of thousands of Palestinians and the takeover of 75% of the land all in just one year between 1948 and 1949 to make way for their new country. If I had lived in Palestine during this time, I don’t think I would have had a very favorable view of the settlers. In fact, I dare say I probably would have hated them. Has Israel ever acknowledged the suffering they caused the Palestinians in the years their Jewish state was founded or the suffering they continue to cause? Of course countries all over the world have caused egregious suffering to others. My Pastor used to say in things like this, “Whoever has the power, tends to abuse it”. I couldn’t agree more. Like you Elsa, I don’t wish Israel out of existence or the US or Canada or Australia. I wouldn’t give a dime for Hamas. It seems like they’ve hijacked what was once a seemingly peaceful people. We’ve talked about the 2 state solution for over 100 years now and it doesn’t seem like it’s working. Israel always says that they’ve offered at least 5 times but in my opinion, they don’t want a 2 state solution anymore than the Palestinians.
Good luck! I often wonder when a situation or issue becomes overly complex to the point that no one understands it. Normally, that complexity is intentional and meant to keep the problem unsolveable. I don't think there is a good solution given the hate that exists. I hope I'm wrong and you learn more that you can share to help lift this veil which hangs over Israel/Gaza.